Does Communism work?

I already have an opinion of my own on Communism, but I want to hear the others.

Do you think Communism works and can be used in countries like the United States, United Kingdom, Germany, (all 1st-3rd world countries).
or
Do you think Communism doesn't work and would hurt countries like the United States, United Kingdom, Germany, (all 1st-3rd world countries).

Exactly which country has communism worked in again ?

Communism will only work in an advanced post-scarcity society, and no place on Earth has entered that state yet. I'm sure it will eventually though, through Capitalism and the Free Market.

Communism only works if some are more equal than others and only the most equal opinions matter.

This is basically how the Star Trek economy worked. Via the magic of replicators and incredibly cheap energy and whatnot, anyone could have pretty much anything at any time. But in a world where there is meaningful scarcity? Communism cannot ever work. It always fails. That doesn't stop idiots from trying though, screaming their battle cry of, "But that wasn't REAL Communism! We'll get it right this time, we promise!"

I'm sure the vast number of Torn players from N. Korea can tell us how well communism works in their country. Oh, wait, they aren't allowed to have internet. Too many pesky free ideas floating around out there. My bad.

Communism hasn't worked but I think that's partly to do with the fact that it's not been allowed to work. Either from corruption within its own government or from outside influences causing it to fail, communism has ended in disaster time and time again.

I think it's nonsense to say that it cannot work though.

An external eye looking into our systems would see the widespread inequality; People literally dying in the streets as others dine with golden cutlery. I reckon they'd probably say that our system was a little bit ****ed too.

It's not just on a national scale either. We measure communism by the nations that have fallen under it. We could equally measure the failures of capitalism by the nations who pay the final price. We've done extremely well out of ****ing other people and their countries over. I think we'll find once we allow true global equality, capitalism might not work out so well.

Your argument of why it hasn't been allowed to work is the same reason as to why it never will: the human element. Greed, pride, gluttony, lust, envy, wrath, and sloth....all things that will never allow people to be fully the same or treated the same. Plus, people are not born the same, with the same level of drive or basic intelligence. I think it's nonsense to say to can work. There will always people that covet power and will do anything to get it. The human spirit is contrary to that kind of system.

From what I understand, true communism has never existed. It's always been portrayed as communism but been turned into socialism or fascism.



Though I'm not saying it would be a good idea. Capitalism encourages people to strive to greater heights, invent new products, and research more ways to improve our way of life. Not that it doesn't have its issues, but overall it's more productive than communism.

Communist Russia made it into space before any other country, thus striving to greater heights ;-)

I also don't think communism would work. It would have to be accepted globally, unless a country was completely self sufficient. As soon as you have to start importing goods and services from a free market economy, it would be impossible to keep up with inflation, destroying your currency, and eventually you would have to pay off debts with gherkins.

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Communism doesn't work. It will never work. EVER. The end. Socialism doesn't even work well unless it's a first world country enacting it through limited scope. All in all, socialism is responsible for some of the worst atrocities in human history. Let's look at a few of them because those that don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it and we don't need this shit.

The holocaust killed at least 4.5million people systematically and was committed by a socialist country.

The holodomor intentionally STARVED 1.8million people to death. Good job USSR.

Pol Pot killed, starved, and tortured 1.4million people in Cambodia specifically to enact Stalinist policies towards enacting Communism. This isn't even including, and I quote, "As of 2009, the Cambodian NGO has mapped some 23,745 mass graves containing approximately 1,386,734 suspected victims of execution."



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Socialism, oh I mean Communism, fails because it goes against human nature. In communism you must submit to the dictates of a collective. We all have desire to improve ourselves through education or working to better ourselves, or our families and communism and even socialism (though admittedly to a much, MUCH lesser degree) don't allow for this or cause this desire to achieve individual success to stagnate. Communism has never really been implemented, it has always historically been a form of socialism.

Capitalism is the perfect system for this want of humanity. We can work within capitalism to better the world, to pull people out of poverty, and to create absolutely mind-blowing breakthroughs in technology and progress. Capitalism is always evaluated against dreams. Utopia is a dream that doesn't exist.

Even in a post scarcity world thousands of years in the future, greed and excessive want is part and parcel to being a human. Allowing big government to provide for the people will not get rid of this greed, nor is government itself free from greed and want.

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Communism fails historically. Every time it is attempted it fails. Anyone thinking communism is good or can be a good thing is living in a fantasy land. When you read Marx, as I encourage everyone to do, read it as fiction.

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"Never will". I just don't buy it. Sure, it wouldn't work tomorrow and it's probably not worth the risk which is why I'm not waving a red flag and marching into London but the status quo we live in is not eternal. Cracks show and more will show until collapse. But there must be a situation in which it would work. A non-utopian circumstance at that.

Living with each other and supporting each other is human nature. If we're talking about what goes against "human nature" I'd probably say the worship of objects and artificial currency.

Remilia's post is brilliant but I just don't agree about the socialism and how she would hate for it be further implemented. The "limited scope" that she sees it possible in reflects the limited scope that she's seen it in. If America became more socialist tomorrow, with all its checks and balances in place, money and protection would transfer from massive corporations to the working populace. And yet those very same workers scream to be kept in on he bottom rung of the ladder.

Perhaps those who think a friendlier system than cut-throat capitalism is possible are living in la la land. But those who think that what we have is the best we'll ever have are walking around with their eyes closed.

There's probably a balance to strike somewhere between the two in my honest opinion.

Here's what would be required for it to work...



Everything as we know it, every where in the world....all current government and social systems.....fail.



99.999% of the population dies.



That 0.001% that lives (about 7,000,000 damned souls) would have to collectively decide to do away with government, laws, and currency, as well as decide to forget everything that is history.



Why? Let's look at the definition of Communism - the philosophical, social, political, and economic ideology and movement whose ultimate goal is the establishment of the communist society, which is a socioeconomic order structured upon the common ownership of the means of production and the absence of social classes, money, and the state.



Please, convince me, in what scenario can you realistically conceive this being viable?



Remember, the OP question was does Communism work, not if Capitalism is good or what are its downfalls.

That's a fair point about this thread. This isn't about capitalism.

And the definition of communism doesn't give much wiggle room in all honesty. Collectively owning the means of production essentially means nobody owns them and they're free for the taking from whoever's in charge of them. In such a scenario control of production would pretty much automatically become ownership.

I withdraw my points, I guess, about communism. Obviously I'm arguing for a kind of socialism. My mistake. Guess I could do with a bit more reading up on the subject now, I was arguing a completely different position.

:)

Its a common mix up, which was where I was hoping it'd go. The two are very often mistaken for each other, socialism and communism. Honestly, Communism is anarchy without the violence that would inevitably happen, because, well...people are a**hats. Someone always has to be in charge. People will always want compensation for work done or services performed.



Want a decent model of socialism working as effectively as possible? The U.S. Military. Now, I say U.S. because that's where I served. I am sure it's this way in other militaries too...



Everybody that's an E5, doesn't matter if they are Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marines make $121 a day base pay. Doesn't matter if they are male, female, black, white, Jew, or Muslim. Everyone that does your job has the same requirements for promotion. Everyone is issued and required to wear the same clothing. Everyone is fed by the government. Everyone is housed by the government. See where I'm going? Now, yes, some live off base, drive nicer cars, eat better food, but that's all things they choose to spend their pay on. Every service member has access to the same everything. Even in that system, there is fraud and corruption, because, well...once again, people suck.



I don't see that function for an entire nation, unless we step back in time because of an EMP or huge meteor.

are you confused mate?

far as i know. communism is where the people get the bare minimum, and the leaders, and their friends get super rich, and live like kings.

capitalism isnt perfect but from looking at the cold war. capitalism takes better care of more people.

That would be a despotic aristocracy I believe, Communism is 'from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs'. In theory. The actuality of it is that only works with unlimited resources, and the only thing Communism seems to have produced in abundance is corpses.

well said

That "balance" could be Corporatism, I believe.