oh oh...
Indifferent. Mafia Victory.
Started by Blight_Lupus [2528155] on in Fun & Games.
Posts archived: 1,799 / 1,799 posts (100%) · the total is Torn's reply count + the opening post at the last fetch
Ouch. Two deaths? And they really picked good targets too...
Ninivah I'd really like to hear your reasonings and stuff rather soon
Ninivah I'd really like to hear your reasonings and stuff rather soon
dedesilver can you confirm you were rbd tonight ?
Oh wow.... I wrote this long old spiel and I have to throw it out the window because now I have to reanalyze.
Vote Blackbird
Vote Blackbird
You gotta be actually kidding me, not only do we lose Denmon, but vigilante (or similar role) misfired? Or, is there a way for the mafia sometimes to kill 2 people one night? Anyone know?
I'd still like to hear the long old spiel. Might help to understand what happened last day change
I'll show you what I had prepares to post today. This is the text I had prepared for today before the reveal.
Okay, I want to address the shinanigans that happened EOD yesterday because it should not be forgotten. This is why I think Den is red.
Today I am going to ask for the full cooperation of town even though what I am saying probably makes little sense to you. Trust me on this one and if I'm wrong, I will gladly give myself up to be lynched the following day.
The Secret
I believe Den and Jhay are red and possible accomplices are Dede, Montfort and Blackbird.
That end of day bandwagon you saw yesterday was no accident. That was a ploy for the reds to pressure me into telling you the secret I keep which is that I was roleblocked night 1. The fact that gabby claimed to be roleblocked and VNG claimed to be the roleblocker confused them because this would mean there are two roleblockers in the game. All yesterday they have been trying to figure out why I wouldn't say anything. So my guess is they probably came to the conclusion that I had an important role. Or possibly that I am the indifferent mafia. Either way, the bandwagon wasn't to kill me, it was to pressure me into roleclaiming or admitting that I was roleblocked but I did neither.
I urge you all to review the bandwagon and how things had been going until then. On day 1 Den accused me of lurking. I explained it by saying I think Day 1 is a non-serious day. I don't typically start scum reading people until day 2 or 3. On Day 1 I typically leave people yo do what they want. Since no one has died, most conversation is redundant, about game rules and mechanics and I don't care to participate in them. I expect people would just drop votes and leave. I don't expect an explanation as to why someone voted the way they did. To me, day 1 only makes sense in retrospect and since I can't time travel, I don't hurt my head trying to figure things out.
Yesterday I was trying to figure out who would roleblock me and why. I have two theories on this.
1. Montfort roleblocked me for voting for her day 1.
2. Mafia roleblocked me. Which leads me to a previous line of thinking. Mafia has at least one vet player. Why else would I be a good candidate to block? The fact that Lum died night 1 is even more telling. Lum is a good player who would give mafia hell.
Someone in mafia is killing strategically.
We aren't being randomly picked off.
I knew that me not saying anything would confuse mafia. I suspect they'd be picking for information but if you didn't know you were missing info you wouldn't realise which conversations were genuine and which were fishing.
Yesterday, I voted for Raius because he pointed out more people might have recieved notes. If the game has trackers, painters or invests or any combination of these then this is obvious and should go without saying. But in the context of others knowing more than others and a secret shadow game going on under the the noses of the townies I did not interpret this as stating the obvious but as fishing. Speaking of which, be wary of those who state the obvious. The difficulty of mafia is to go along without revealing they know more than they do. One way to counter this is by stating the obvious. After reviewing Day 2 while it was going on, I saw that Raius was echoing Blackbird.
Who is Blackbird? Another vet not really contributing to the discussion. Randomly chiming in. Sometimes mafia appear green by latching on to townies. I think Blackbird ia doing this.
Den is the bold mafia.
Blackbird the compassionate mafia.
Lurking?
Day 2 Jhay accuses me of lurking despite the fact that I had made more posts than him up to then. I had been actively participating in the game, giving my opinion whilst he had only posted a line or two. If he were active enough to 'notice' me 'lurking' then that would mean Jhay was lurking as well? Why would he call me out for something he himself was doing? Compare our early Day 2 actions. Have I not been more helpful than Jhay? Did I look like I was lurking? As a matter of fact, if Den felt like I 'still' was lurking then why didn't he call me out himself? He has never hesitated to go after me so why let someone else do it?
Let me tell you where that lurking comment came from and why Jhay and Den felt so bold to make that play. I had been rereading Day 1 and liking comments as I went along. This clearly signaled to Den that I was reading the forums. Why then, if he was suspicious of me, why didn't he call me out? It's simple, power in numbers. He got Jhay to make the claim because if he did it, I'd easily counter it but if two people made the claim that I was 'lurking' and 'didn't seem myself', it would lend credibility to the claim. Look who they roped into the claim, GD and VNG who have never played with me. Two votes unexperienced enough to even fathom that what they were reading was pure BS.
WTF VNG!
Now that VNG has been brought up, its a good time to being up his shinanigans. Yesterday VNG claimed to be a roleblocker. Why didn't Den question him. Yesterday, keen mind Den opted to barely addressed any of VNGs behaviour which does indeed warrant suspicion and instead opted to bandwagon me with no evidence of anything. Does that not seem strange to any of you? VNG blatantly tried to tie votes yesterday for a double lynch and all Den could think to do in that moment is get me killed. Think about it. Would a green Den play like that? Would a green Den be okay with two dead townies dead because of pure emotion
and stupidity? Why would a logical, factual townie Den let that happen?
You've made it this far, is it making sense to you now?
Dede the Investigator?
So it's day 2 and you're the investigator. You've only researched one person so far. Would you soft claim your ability knowing that outed invests are basically doomed to die? As town, when you're dropping hints you have to assume the mafia will get what you're saying as well. You have to assume mafia will understand and town won't. I ask you, why would the invest risk that for only one reveal?
I see Dede asking questions at night. You might be willing to chalk it up to Dede being inexperienced but I doubt it. And now we are back to Den. Why would Den accept this. Why isn't Den thinking any of this could be a conspiracy? If I'm mafia and his foe then why doesn't he think I may be orchastrating any of this?
Tell me, town, has Den been your champion? Do you truly believe that he has your best interest? Has Den been acting like he wants town to win this?
Yesterday I was wholly prepared to vote for Shar. I was going to put in my vote and call it a day. I'm familiar with the trope that if Den lives past day 3 he's red. I find Den to be formidable. I want him to be my teammate. In the past I have accidentally caused town to lynch a green Den because of my suspicion of him. I have been trying to avoid that this time. I think I now have adequate reason to come after Den.
The Proposal
So here's what I propose to town today. Choose me or Den. If I had the gladiator ability I'd use it. Today I ask that town not divert any of their votes to anyone else.
I am completely willing to die today but I ask that you force Den to orove his allegence. Only vote for Den if he specifically asks you to.
If he so believes I'm red and he is green, he shouldn't be afraid to get ride of me. He should be willing to out his neck in the noose.
I know I am.
If you vote for Den and he is green, I'll gladly die tomorrow, no fighting. If you vote for me at Den's behest and I am green, you can decide if you wsnt him dead tomorrow. If I die tonight, it will prove I'm green and you can decide if you want to lynch Den the next day.
The Challenge
Yesterday Den said he would write a full explanation as to why I'm red. I demand to see that. Do not vote for me unless Den provides it and asks you to. He should back his motives with proper reasoning. Den isn't a lazy player so don't accept lazy reasoning.
At first I asked this of Den but I now ask this of Jhay. Two 'greens' with the same line of thinking who feel so strongly they should be held accountable. Their feet should be held to the fire.
Demand an answer from them and if it's not good enough, consider lynching them.
Okay, I want to address the shinanigans that happened EOD yesterday because it should not be forgotten. This is why I think Den is red.
Today I am going to ask for the full cooperation of town even though what I am saying probably makes little sense to you. Trust me on this one and if I'm wrong, I will gladly give myself up to be lynched the following day.
The Secret
I believe Den and Jhay are red and possible accomplices are Dede, Montfort and Blackbird.
That end of day bandwagon you saw yesterday was no accident. That was a ploy for the reds to pressure me into telling you the secret I keep which is that I was roleblocked night 1. The fact that gabby claimed to be roleblocked and VNG claimed to be the roleblocker confused them because this would mean there are two roleblockers in the game. All yesterday they have been trying to figure out why I wouldn't say anything. So my guess is they probably came to the conclusion that I had an important role. Or possibly that I am the indifferent mafia. Either way, the bandwagon wasn't to kill me, it was to pressure me into roleclaiming or admitting that I was roleblocked but I did neither.
I urge you all to review the bandwagon and how things had been going until then. On day 1 Den accused me of lurking. I explained it by saying I think Day 1 is a non-serious day. I don't typically start scum reading people until day 2 or 3. On Day 1 I typically leave people yo do what they want. Since no one has died, most conversation is redundant, about game rules and mechanics and I don't care to participate in them. I expect people would just drop votes and leave. I don't expect an explanation as to why someone voted the way they did. To me, day 1 only makes sense in retrospect and since I can't time travel, I don't hurt my head trying to figure things out.
Yesterday I was trying to figure out who would roleblock me and why. I have two theories on this.
1. Montfort roleblocked me for voting for her day 1.
2. Mafia roleblocked me. Which leads me to a previous line of thinking. Mafia has at least one vet player. Why else would I be a good candidate to block? The fact that Lum died night 1 is even more telling. Lum is a good player who would give mafia hell.
Someone in mafia is killing strategically.
We aren't being randomly picked off.
I knew that me not saying anything would confuse mafia. I suspect they'd be picking for information but if you didn't know you were missing info you wouldn't realise which conversations were genuine and which were fishing.
Yesterday, I voted for Raius because he pointed out more people might have recieved notes. If the game has trackers, painters or invests or any combination of these then this is obvious and should go without saying. But in the context of others knowing more than others and a secret shadow game going on under the the noses of the townies I did not interpret this as stating the obvious but as fishing. Speaking of which, be wary of those who state the obvious. The difficulty of mafia is to go along without revealing they know more than they do. One way to counter this is by stating the obvious. After reviewing Day 2 while it was going on, I saw that Raius was echoing Blackbird.
Who is Blackbird? Another vet not really contributing to the discussion. Randomly chiming in. Sometimes mafia appear green by latching on to townies. I think Blackbird ia doing this.
Den is the bold mafia.
Blackbird the compassionate mafia.
Lurking?
Day 2 Jhay accuses me of lurking despite the fact that I had made more posts than him up to then. I had been actively participating in the game, giving my opinion whilst he had only posted a line or two. If he were active enough to 'notice' me 'lurking' then that would mean Jhay was lurking as well? Why would he call me out for something he himself was doing? Compare our early Day 2 actions. Have I not been more helpful than Jhay? Did I look like I was lurking? As a matter of fact, if Den felt like I 'still' was lurking then why didn't he call me out himself? He has never hesitated to go after me so why let someone else do it?
Let me tell you where that lurking comment came from and why Jhay and Den felt so bold to make that play. I had been rereading Day 1 and liking comments as I went along. This clearly signaled to Den that I was reading the forums. Why then, if he was suspicious of me, why didn't he call me out? It's simple, power in numbers. He got Jhay to make the claim because if he did it, I'd easily counter it but if two people made the claim that I was 'lurking' and 'didn't seem myself', it would lend credibility to the claim. Look who they roped into the claim, GD and VNG who have never played with me. Two votes unexperienced enough to even fathom that what they were reading was pure BS.
WTF VNG!
Now that VNG has been brought up, its a good time to being up his shinanigans. Yesterday VNG claimed to be a roleblocker. Why didn't Den question him. Yesterday, keen mind Den opted to barely addressed any of VNGs behaviour which does indeed warrant suspicion and instead opted to bandwagon me with no evidence of anything. Does that not seem strange to any of you? VNG blatantly tried to tie votes yesterday for a double lynch and all Den could think to do in that moment is get me killed. Think about it. Would a green Den play like that? Would a green Den be okay with two dead townies dead because of pure emotion
and stupidity? Why would a logical, factual townie Den let that happen?
You've made it this far, is it making sense to you now?
Dede the Investigator?
So it's day 2 and you're the investigator. You've only researched one person so far. Would you soft claim your ability knowing that outed invests are basically doomed to die? As town, when you're dropping hints you have to assume the mafia will get what you're saying as well. You have to assume mafia will understand and town won't. I ask you, why would the invest risk that for only one reveal?
I see Dede asking questions at night. You might be willing to chalk it up to Dede being inexperienced but I doubt it. And now we are back to Den. Why would Den accept this. Why isn't Den thinking any of this could be a conspiracy? If I'm mafia and his foe then why doesn't he think I may be orchastrating any of this?
Tell me, town, has Den been your champion? Do you truly believe that he has your best interest? Has Den been acting like he wants town to win this?
Yesterday I was wholly prepared to vote for Shar. I was going to put in my vote and call it a day. I'm familiar with the trope that if Den lives past day 3 he's red. I find Den to be formidable. I want him to be my teammate. In the past I have accidentally caused town to lynch a green Den because of my suspicion of him. I have been trying to avoid that this time. I think I now have adequate reason to come after Den.
The Proposal
So here's what I propose to town today. Choose me or Den. If I had the gladiator ability I'd use it. Today I ask that town not divert any of their votes to anyone else.
I am completely willing to die today but I ask that you force Den to orove his allegence. Only vote for Den if he specifically asks you to.
If he so believes I'm red and he is green, he shouldn't be afraid to get ride of me. He should be willing to out his neck in the noose.
I know I am.
If you vote for Den and he is green, I'll gladly die tomorrow, no fighting. If you vote for me at Den's behest and I am green, you can decide if you wsnt him dead tomorrow. If I die tonight, it will prove I'm green and you can decide if you want to lynch Den the next day.
The Challenge
Yesterday Den said he would write a full explanation as to why I'm red. I demand to see that. Do not vote for me unless Den provides it and asks you to. He should back his motives with proper reasoning. Den isn't a lazy player so don't accept lazy reasoning.
At first I asked this of Den but I now ask this of Jhay. Two 'greens' with the same line of thinking who feel so strongly they should be held accountable. Their feet should be held to the fire.
Demand an answer from them and if it's not good enough, consider lynching them.
SORRY. I killed monfort. Im now just a vanilla @_@
Could be a town killer, could be a second mafia killer.
I'd currently hope on a town killer, no matter what sort.
I'd currently hope on a town killer, no matter what sort.
This is my mafia list
Blackbird
Jhay
Dede
????
Blackbird
Jhay
Dede
????
O.o
Seriously wtf... I need time to think. My vote stays on Blackbird though.
Seriously wtf... I need time to think. My vote stays on Blackbird though.
All Mafia members know who each other are. The Indifferent Mafia member will be seen as a regular Mafia member by their teammates.
JS
JS
Hmmm.
Well, yeah, I definitely agree that a vet is in the mafia, or someone who has played a while and knows all the Vets.
It would make sense for the second roleblocker to be mafia (Yes I believe VNG is a town roleblocker). Night 1 they killed and cleaned Lumi, Night 2 the same with Denmon. If the roleblocker is mafia then targetting Ninivah is a good idea too early on. Lots of very clear targetting.
Well, yeah, I definitely agree that a vet is in the mafia, or someone who has played a while and knows all the Vets.
It would make sense for the second roleblocker to be mafia (Yes I believe VNG is a town roleblocker). Night 1 they killed and cleaned Lumi, Night 2 the same with Denmon. If the roleblocker is mafia then targetting Ninivah is a good idea too early on. Lots of very clear targetting.
Den was the indifferent.
._.
One shot vig then I assume.
This would be very bold to claim as mafia. Well, I guess if the mafia do have a second one shot killer then it would be easy, but in any other case it would be kinda weird for mafia to claim.
(Btw why the random shot ._.)
One shot vig then I assume.
This would be very bold to claim as mafia. Well, I guess if the mafia do have a second one shot killer then it would be easy, but in any other case it would be kinda weird for mafia to claim.
(Btw why the random shot ._.)
why ? most your arguments about then didnt convince me, but about the other names you mentioned yes. I personally I am not interested in lynching you yet. I m half sold on blackbird, ut i want to wait for dede and gabby to talk first
im also leaning towards believing jhay, so I ll ask him to vote with me, since i consider he is the closest to believe being a townie so far after me, but doesnt have enough credibility yet to direct the votes. again, waiting for other players input as i believe there will be a lot to say
So working theory is that Den is the indifferent mafia. I still need to think of this.
Jhay, I still want an explanation from you though you are vig.
I want it be noted that I was roleblocked a second night so who has a hard on for me? A vet most likely.
Blackbird, what do you have to say for yourself.
Jhay, I still want an explanation from you though you are vig.
I want it be noted that I was roleblocked a second night so who has a hard on for me? A vet most likely.
Blackbird, what do you have to say for yourself.
The way you say it and what you quoted do you mean the mafia indifferent? Cause that makes no sense to me.
Or do you mean the second town indifferent? Then I will echo VNG, why?
Or do you mean the second town indifferent? Then I will echo VNG, why?
if den was indeff mafia his teammates would see himas only mafia, why would he betheir target ? am i missing something obvious ?