CE

Do I lose any CE for being hospitalized in Arson?

Probably, but we don't know for sure

Well, your nerve bar can drop from faild arsons. So it's probably CE loss too.

Faild crimes that end up in hospitalization are much less damaging to CE than the ones that put you in jail though.

Can you provide your evidence for this? As far as I'm aware, CE is hidden, and hospitalizations have not been demonstrated to lose CE.

Nerve bar drop/gain can be delayed, so just wondering what evidence you have (or have seen) that has definitively shown that an arson hospitalization was the cause.

Thanks!

Double post

Can't sorry.

Maybe someone with a delicate nerve bar can, long ago right after I got my 45 bar I switched back to arsons only, done a few with success and then got a red. It dropped back to 40. (I don't remember exactly how long it took to get it back to 45 though)

It could be due to still being on the edge but I highly doubt that. Just to be clear; the last crime I did was the red result from arson before it dropped.

Barely any loss. Its expected to fail a crime here and there. It won't drop your nb...but if you continue to fail hacking crimes it will drop

IF you lose any crime experience from being hospitalized, it's a very small amount, even less than you gain from a success. Because it would be so small if it did exist, it is safe to say that you do not lose any CE from being hospitalized.

Got my 35nb not too many days ago, Arson made it happen. I don't think hospitals hurt CE. A lot better than jail.

should I continue with Arson warehouse? I failed 3 out of the 11 I did yesterday. Today I didn't fail any out of the 4 I have done so far.

ive been failing a heap more lately as well, if i fail one i just go back to something easy for about a day, but im not sure based on what other people are saying youll be safe

That is just not true. When you fail, you lose a % of your current CE. When you succeed a crime, you gain a fixed amount. that's why it takes so long to regain your lost NB.

There is in this thread laid down evidence that hosp reduces your CE by just a little bit, and in some cases it can be enough to tilt back the NB a notch. However, when I gained my 35 NB, I remember bein hospitalised by Arson a few times early on, but I didn't lose my NB. However, at NB 45, the % loss will add up to a larger amount of CE than at 35 NB.

Are you calling Jimmy James a dummy? :o

You say it's not true, yet provide an example of your own experience that supports my statement?

It has been demonstrated that you lose a % of your CE when you go to JAIL. It has never been shown that you lose any CE from going to hospital.

You say there is evidence laid down in this thread....care to point out where that evidence is? I've seen only an anecdotal story, and as you know, anecdotes are how rumours get started, and rumours are not fact.

Given that the current crime system has a crime success rate cap (about 96% greens for warehouse arson), this means that you will get browns and reds at a certain (slightly fluctuating) percentage rate, no matter how much CE you have.

What this means is, if you have OPTIMAL CE for the crime, or MORE than optimal, then your success rate over time will never be higher (over time) than 96% greens on warehouse arson, and the rest made up of browns/reds. So if you get a 'run' of greens that pushes you up (temporarily) to, say, 98% greens total, then you will get some browns/reds to push you back down to, or below the success rate cap.

Every single crime that I've ever tested in the game has this success rate cap, at different 'optimal CE' levels required, and different %'s of red/green/brown. Exceptions of course are ones like jacket thefts, in which the success rate is capped at 100% greens for optimal/above optimal CE.


So:
1. Did you carefully track your crimes and success rate to see where your success rate % was at when you started failing?
2. Do you have any evidence that is not anecdotal?

REPOST of one of my posts on the OLD forum about success rate cap & Warehouse arson. Posting again here as it seems relevant:

Link
Warehouse Arson
45NNB
psychology bachelor
~21,000 busts
10 merits on crime success
max rank in law job

Crime count: 639
Nerve used: 7,029 (11.00 per crime)
Greens: 613 (95.93%)
Reds: 15 (2.35%)
Browns: 11 (1.72%)


Jewelz
Warehouse Arson
45NNB
~6300 busts
10 merits on Crime success

Crime count: 631
Nerve used: 6,941 (11.00 per crime)
Greens: 608 (96.35%)
Reds: 8 (1.27%)
Browns: 15 (2.38%)

Link (second test)
Warehouse Arson
45NNB
Psychology Bachelor
~ 23,000 busts
10 merits on crime success
max rank in law job

Crime count: 511
Nerve used: 5,621 (11.00 per crime)
Greens: 489 (95.69%)
Reds: 10 (1.96%)
Browns: 12 (2.35%)

If you notice on my 2 samples of warehouse arson, my browns & reds % switched places (2.35%) and Jewelz' brown rate is also @ ~ 2.3x%. Our greens are almost identical even though I have much more CE than she does and 10% more CSR: all around 96% give or take.Since my reds & browns have 'swapped' percentages after gaining more CE (through busting and successful Political Assassinations) then I do not think it's likely that bogie is correct about crimes wanting you to 'move on' to a harder crime - unless that applies to certain crimes only. I think it far more likely at this stage that there *is* a crime success rate cap and warehouse arson seems to be ~ 96% for someone with optimum CE.

Old Forums Thread (crappy formatting there ugh!)


~~~

I only ever do safe crimes to safeguard my CE, so I have tested and confirmed success rate caps for other crimes (which I have somewhere) but I do not have information about the 'risky' crimes sorry. However my conclusion is that, at least as far as all the crimes I've done ingame, they all have a success rate cap. I would assume by that, that the risky ones do, as well.

In order to test whether hospitalization from failed crime can lose you CE, you'd need to discount all other variables you possibly can - so don't participate in any activity during testing that can give you CE gain. Then do a crime (or crimes) that have a high fail rate that HOSPS you (not jail).

Is there such a crime? As I said, I don't do risky crimes, I don't know about that.

Also it'd be best to have a flimsy nerve bar (not a solid 45 or anything) to do the testing. Lastly, I think there should not be any conclusions based on anyone who 'just got' a new nerve bar size. There might be some other variable at play there which may have nothing to do with jail or hospital at all, but perhaps the failure itself?

Warehouse arson is a shitty one to test this hypothesis on. With a 96% success rate cap, there's too much success (so too much potential to gain CE). I am sceptical of any CE losses reported when doing warehouse arson. I think there are other variables not being considered - and those who report their anecdotes NEVER address the success rate cap when presenting their case.


Unfortunately I have a VERY solid 45, so I can't do the testing for this, but I would if I could :)

I started doing drug crimes last month, 27 jailings and about 1000 successful and still have my 45 nb. So I'm sure it's "flimsy" if you want a guinea pig.

Well... having done only arson for a while, and having seen my crime bar drop during that time, I am quite confident that a failed arson does indeed result in a CE-loss.

Something that can be overlooked sometimes are OC's while doing crimes. Personally I really can't remember if I was participating in an OC that failed during the time I was doing only arsons and had my bar dropping.
It's very possible though!

Link has a point, unless this gets tested specifically without doing anything else that has any effect on CE we can't be 100% sure.

Until then however, we all can be sure that even if hosping from arsons results some CE loss, it is minimal.