Considering that committeee were warned before joining the committee that their account will be deleted, I think it's fair that his account should be deleted.
With great power, comes great responsibility. If you didn't have the balls to bear the responsibility, why the hell did you join the committee.
Even though quite alot of committee members are famous players on Torn, I don't think they should get special treatment. Why should a committee member get outta fed jail cause he's famous on Torn. Think about the normal players as well, when they get fedded they don't get any special treatment, they get fedded and there's nothing they can do.
If you forgive a player cause he's famous on Torn, again some "famous" commitee member can abuse the info and get away with the crying of his fans on General discussion etc.
The ones who break the rules, should get deleted. Simple as that!
If you think I care about Karma, you're wrong. You should send a newsletter on your faction and get them all to downrate my post. It won't change my opinion.
Yep sorry, lots of pages, lost a lot of it. I get your point about stupid mistakes but honestly imo that just can't make the cut. What if we all just 'get one mistake'? That sets a horrible precedent.
If this is Marc setting out his stall so to speak then as long as this is consistent for all future cases then no one can complain, the thing that concerns me is future incidents being brushed under the carpet like cases in the past, this is what causes divide and frustration throughout
it cannot be one rule for one and another for another, it HAS to be same rule for all regardless
I think it clearly is: Marc said "this thread is not about the player in question but about us being open in the way we want Torn to run, fairly and transparently"
I want transparency with regards to scripting rules and to what extent they can be (ab)used.
Now i see what MarlonBrando means. Someone in staff is unfit for their position, in my humble opinion. The funny thing is that its been harder to become staff here than it was for me to get into Medical School at the University of Washington, which was my dream as a kid. In my opinion im more than qualified to lead an administrative position here, im trilingual, and moderated a minecraft online server. Dealt with punishment and what is going on here i don't agree. Thats my opinion. Howd we would dealt with the accused was lesser punishment 6months, followed by permanent deletion.
This fed is getting way too much attention imho.. It is very clear what happens if you spill things from the committee, allbeit info or items. You get deleted, period.
If this where a less known committee member they'd also get deleted and no one would even whistle.
Sending a useless item to someone that was going to be released in a couple days....Delete your 10 year old account. Your contributions to the game do not matter. You did pretty much nothing. 10 years of service to the game, f**k you we don't care.
I'm glad you've made this public yourselves. The game is showing it's true colours, that it does not care about the players, and if staff do not like you, you will be abused, fedded, and even deleted, one way or another.
People laugh when some players say staff are abusing them. Yes, it happens, and probably more than some may think. People will laugh until it happens to them. The bias, and nepotism is uncanny here. Any thoughts of me subscribing are now long gone.
The real cheats run rampant, while sending a useless item a couple day before it was released = deletion of 10 year old account.
I'm of the opinion that deleting his account is the right thing to do.that is the only deterrent scary enough to some that would keep them from sharing insider secrets.personally i would break those rules if i was to just get a 90 day ban. but the punishment should stop short of him not being allowed to restart.
First, Midknight is definitely not my friend nor someone I would want to defend. Yes, I have known him through the game for quite a while, and we have spoken, argued, sometimes agreed on things, sometimes haven't, but it doesn't influence one bit what I will say next as I would say this for any player of his age and statue in the game.
If this is the only thing he did, and this is his first offense (I do not see his history), then the punishment is completely absurd.
We're talking about a player, who gave 10+ years of his life to this game. His crime sucks, and it will hurt those that are left in the Committee as it will fuel corruption and conspiracy theories about the people in the committee, but that can be avoided by making his case public, which you did. Name him, shame him, write a newsletter article about him. Take him off the committee, give him a forum ban, slap him with a decent fed time to cool off and think what he's done, take away his cash, all that - absolutely, but a momentary lapse of reason or moment of bad judgement vs 10+ years of impeccable service to this game (again, assuming this is his first offense) and to get a deletion for it, is seriously, way, way, wayyyy wrong.
Yes, it will discourage people to do such things knowing they face harsh penalties, but how many good players will it also discourage to come forth and offer their help knowing that they face the same thing in case they do something wrong?
There are far worse crimes that affect a lot more people that are treated with much lesser penalties or no penalties at all (who said stock script), and yes, I know that veterans are treated differently, contrary to what people believe, much more harshly and we're expected to uphold a higher standard and even more is required of committee and staff members, I understand the reasoning behind this, I really do. But even with all the understanding I do not believe that the punishment fits the crime, it completely and absolutely absurd.
And yes, I do hope you reconsider his penalty and make it something appropriate.
When older incidents are referred it is said that " I was not there in authority when the judgement was given out ". And again after few months things will change and when we will report something again it will be said " I was not there in authority when the judgement was given out". So if the punishment is different to different people...........
IMO, only multies should be deleted, other players can be punished by taking away what they gained and more, fed time of course, stats reduced and so on - many ways to punish, but deleting is way too harsh.
I understand the arguments for lifting the ban but I can't bring myself to agree. The consequences were given at the beginning of signing up to be a committee member. Furthermore he was told not to do something and he did it anyway. Mistake or not sometimes you only get one chance. It seems sad to let go such a player with no other misdeeds but the pied pipper came to collect.
Speaking from a civilian point of view, I won't deny feeling some jealousy when I see staff collectibles and thinking about what the player committee gets to know before I do.
I was kinda confused and jealous when I saw iced fruit cakes in the auction house but I figured maybe Ched is giving them a gift for helping out. I had no idea that there were limits to when items can be released to the general public. No idea that people could actually get in trouble for selling/ giving pre-released items away. I guess selling iced fruit cakes was okay since there were so many of them on the market.
Where I'm getting at is maybe it would benefit everyone if everyone could know the rules. We can't simply rely on staff to keep staff in check when they can't always be around to see abuse and civilians can't report anything if they don't even know they're witnessing violations.
I say let this case be a hallmark to all staff and commitee members that they will be held accountible. The past can't be changed but future offenders should be dealt the same punishment. You're being given a privelege lots of players don't have and it shouldn't be abused or given to the arrogant or self-serving.
Nope. My point was that he sent the item not sold it. He didn't break the rule. He didn't receive any cash. he did not profit in any way. Ched never said you can't send items. If he said to someone else they could sell it, again technically he didn't sell and didn't ask for any cash. This is why if he is to be deleted, surely we should be 100% sure he broke the rules. We cannot be sure he actually broke the rules set out.
That is why I do not feel deletion is fair. We are deleting a player that has played for 10+ years on a grey area. Rules should be fully set out. Eg you must not send items gained from committee tests. You must not use items gained from... Etc.
The rules are not clear, yet you delete someone for it. Extremely unfair, unjust and absurd.
1- Most of comments from staff belonging to a certain group is pure point finger and naming of other fellow players not belonging to their group. 2- Extreme stubbornness in magnitude of punishment 3- No equivalent treatment for previous cases with much more magnitude. 4- Unprecedented skew in staff in favor of a certain group/faction 5- Clear conflict of interest not only endured by MK but apparently by most infavor for their frnds/faction collegues