China is cooked

Operation Paperclip wasn't IP theft

The US was certainly stagnating under Biden. Thankfully that's not the case anymore

I don't care about that, in the end technology is made by humans, not countries.

I think the IP system holds humans back.

Sounds like you're having problems reconciling the ideal vs the real

No, I have my own principles.

Which OS do you think is better, Linux or Windows?

Well, that's a rabbit hole. 

I've been using Linux off and on since 2012. I prefer it for the amount of control it gives me over my operating system, and when it comes to setting up a development environment, I find it more ideal than Windows (however, for certain tech stacks there are exceptions to this). 

With that being said, I'm an avid gamer. Linux is much better nowadays with gaming compared to when I first started using Linux. You don't even really need to use WINE anymore. But you can still encounter issues with certain games.

However, there are still some issues with stability. So I find myself often returning back to Windows when I find myself growing fatigued with the maintenance that Linux can require. But a part of that is on me, as I tend to gravitate towards less common distributions, like Manjaro. I'm sure I'd have less headaches if I used something like Ubuntu.

Edit: I'm also not a fan of Microsoft's coercive business practices. And Windows 11, especially 24H2 has had nothing but continual issues. I work in tech support, and I'd saying a good 75% of the calls I receive are due to issues relating to Windows 11. What makes it even worse is that the rumour coming out of their insider program is that they're considering pivoting to a subscription based model for Windows 12. If that happens, a lot of people will switch to Mac or Linux.

Having your own principles is fine. When it comes to how you would want to see the world, vs how I want to see the world, there probably wouldn't be much difference. However, I recognize human nature as it is, and realize that many things I'd ideally like to see, just aren't practical, because as a whole, we aren't able to change human nature. Because of the fact that tribalism/in-group preference is innate to humans, we need to then protect our own tribe. Things like IP surrounding emergent technologies crucial to our own security then become a de facto need, rather than simply a preference.

Linux is the better one.

Game studios and hardware companies just go for the money that's why Windows is (still) better for gaming.

But Linux gives you a much more stable and.bloar.free experience, because it's all open source, everyone can work on it to improve it, or.build.on it.

It's just a silly example, but it shows that IP does actually hinder progression.

I think it's more of an issue with the monopoly that Microsoft has more so than anything to do with IP. I'm fine with Windows being closed-source, or any other product for that matter

The monopoly can be there because of IP's

I'm not sure that's entirely true. Windows has a monopoly because Microsoft has the ability to throw billions of dollars at companies to use their product exclusively. Even still, Windows only accounts for 6% of Microsoft's revenue. If we for a second pretended as though the OS that Microsoft peddled was instead Ubuntu, the loss of revenue wouldn't really hurt Microsoft, and they would still have their monopoly.

They got that billions because of IP's

Besides the fact that most IP,s are not even owned by the people that actually invented them

Because the IP was sold, or because the ones that made it signed an agreement that their work would be owned by the company they work for (which, is basically every place of employment).

You have to think about the incentive structure. Again, we come back to the emergent realities of human nature. 

They say that absolute power corrupts absolutely. Windows used to be a great operating system. Then they got to a point where they were too big to fail, and started implementing shady business practices, and forcing things down consumer's throats that they didn't even want. But this is waning. The more consumers grow fed up with the business practices of Microsoft, the more potential there is for a true competitor to arise. 

It's a cycle. 

Product A is better than all other products. Product A receives mass adoption. The company (Company A) that owns Product A grows insanely rich. Company A starts doing some shady things in order to make even more money, and to try and stomp out competition. Consumers of Product A grow fed up, and more and more start adopting Product B. Eventually, a tipping point is reached that causes Product B to surge in popularity. Product A and Product B start having legitimate competition, and during this time we see lots of innovation on both sides. One product wins this competition, and the cycle repeats.

Well if.you.love it so much, today over 50 percent of IPs are filed by Chinese companies. Worldwide.

Because they are growing more technologically advanced than the rest of the world.

Furthermore, I believe people invent things because they want to advance humanity, companies that have a more capatañist view use IP's solely to make money, I think that's morally bankrupt.

I think both of the opinions you just posited are over simplifications 

China inflates their numbers, in addition to them stealing IP from other nations, changing a few variables, and then calling it their own. 

People do invent things in order to advance humanity, and people work for corporations that utilize IP to protect their hard work. But yes, corporations tend to lose the initial vision that started their journey, and it eventually becomes more about money. This is why competition is needed, because without competition they can do whatever they want to milk something  for money. With competition, they are compelled to align with the desires of their consumer base, rather than just taking advantage of them.

You can't steal IP's lol. Once it is an IP someone else can't claim it.

pretty sure he just means they don't respect the IP and use it for their own purpose

Stealing IP, reverse engineering it, and making their own product from their findings, happens literally all the time, and makes up a significant portion of China's IP. They typically get away with it, but their are a few exceptions, like Sionvel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinovel#Controversies

Stop looking for a gotcha. It's ruining this conversation that has miraculously been pretty decent over the last few replies.

I'm pretty sure the US also do it, like how Google stole the IP of Google maps.

Well for one thing, they were found innocent in a jury trial regarding that. I'm not saying the justice system is perfect, by the way. But I don't think it's for us to decide autonomously whether a particular party is guilty or not based upon our own leanings. I think that's a slippery slope. 

And for another thing, with China it is a matter of state policy. I'm not saying that the U.S government doesn't engage in their fair share of IP theft, they probably routinely reverse engineer the technology produced by foreign adversaries, but companies who are proven guilty for IP theft in the United States are prosecuted. 

I'm good friends with a Chinese person who travels back and forth. One thing he says the American media never points out that China has been successfully supporting policies within Taiwan to support reunification. Basically advertising and marketing. And according to him its working. Because of this he feels it is way more likely for the Taiwanese to imply vote for reunification than an invasion. 

What I find telling is the complete absence of this angle from all news sources.

Thoughts?

Taiwan Public Opinion Foundation (TPOF), November 2025

• 44.3% prefer Taiwan independence.
• 24.6% prefer maintaining the status quo.
• 13.9% prefer unification with China.
• 17.3% don't know/no opinion.

Of course China is trying to use it's influence to shift the Overton window within China to make the concept of "reunification" (that is, PROC absorbing ROC and subjecting it to the same assimilation tactics it uses with other groups) more desirable. But no, it isn't working.