Beware of vault thief

A long time if hes not a retarded pussy

I see the fair and square argument with the faction it self but he took all the balances from their facmates  thats the main dick move here.

If he would have given the members their fonds and weps and then sold the fac yeah maybe it would be some sort of morally grey.

Tbf he got a fac he didnt want or expect

while its not nice to do what he did, he didnt scam and didnt steal. He got gifted something by game and handled it his way

he really shouldve just given leader to someone who wanted lol

he stole from the faction members genius

Fac vault is an agreement between bankers/leader and members to hold money and return it when the members ask for it

This ben character didnt make that agreement. Its as if i make a fac and tell the members they cant use vault, any deposits become mine. If they decide to place money into a vault they cant freely use, they cant expect the owner of that vault to stick to some agreement they didnt make

im not defending the guy, im just saying, torn mechanics gave him a faction, he took the cash in faction vault, which technically belonged to him. Ofc its a scummy thing to do, but many facs harbor scummy people and just dont give them bank perms. Bad luck for the noobs in the fac ig, and if the leader knew he was gonna go inactive, he should’ve assigned a colead

Yeah 1.2b isn’t worth the grief, and that’s coming from someone that’s been in debt on torn for 5 years.

It sure sounds like you are defending the person. Because the system made him the leader doesn't make the money in the vault his. What a retarded thing to say.

its like saying if you get gifted a wallet with a bunch of IOUs and cash, and you keep the cash and ignore the bills, ur stealing from the people oewd. im not defending the guy. he shuoldnt have done what he did, it was scummy. it was also not stealing

So the inactive leader hadn't set a co-leader position?

Sounds like a them problem to me.

Edit: Not saying its not a bit shitty, just that it isn't only OP to blame here...

Maybe you all should have withdrawn your balances before the system made the leader switch ...

If someone else has access to your money, but you don't. Who's money is that really? 

Stop leaving money in your factions.. It doesn't even grow.

No.  The funds belonging to the faction, and the faction belonging to him per game rules, are what make the funds technically his.

Funds in a faction vault do not count toward player NW, and when a faction is disbanded vault funds go from the system to the leader, not the members.  The money does not belong to the members until the funds hit their wallets.  

This is an important thing to consider when ‘storing’ money in a faction.

Everything he has done is a ‘legal’ move per game rules.  Game rules treat vault money as faction, not member funds.

The summary of this situation is, it is not illegal to be a dick.

Additionally, it is also legal for the disgruntled membership and sympathetic parties to hosp this guy until his grandchildren are in the nursing home.

You couldn't get him off on a technicality without letting nearly every other vault thief off on the same technicality.

Because 'intent' is always taken at the time the 'crime' is committed.  It's essentially irrelevant what you did or didn't want to do leading up to it.

You seem to be saying that an absence of premeditation makes it ok.  So essentially people like LAT or MightyGoober would equally get a pass because they didn't set out to scam, just took the opportunity one day after otherwise not scamming for a long time.

Vault thiefs like CPrinceC who set out to build trust with the express intention of committing a vault theft are the minority.

I think the distinction is that Lat, for example, abused confidence placed in her by the faction (so, a confidence trick or con in the classic sense).

There was no point at which the system turned over ownership of the faction and contents to Lat.  Rather, they abused a joint access.  It’s an interesting technical point as to whether they are guilty of theft from other faction co-owners only, and that may be true. But at the very minimum, they stole from the faction co-owners who entrusted them with access.

In this case, it is different.  The accused was awarded the faction after the triggering of a pre-set condition, one clearly stated in the game rules and known to all.  They were the most senior member in the faction when the leader timed out.  There was a transfer of ownership that did not occur in Lat’s case.

A vault theft is either: 

Ok because it's not member's funds anyway; OR

It's not ok because whoever had control of those funds and took them was taking members funds.

Yes everyone knows that faction funds aren't member funds - BUT even if they were it still wouldn't be against the game rules because scamming is allowed...so not sure why you're hanging your hat there.

It wasn't like the thief here just woke up and found his investment bank had extra cash with no idea where it came from - he literally went through and wiped the balance of every one of his faction mates and made the express decision to take that cash for himself.

The trust of his factionmates transferred to him and he crapped all over them.

Any technical argument that this is kind of 'ok' just because it didn't involve leadership trust is a weird one to make.

Or it’s not okay because it constitutes theft from the other leaders (and the gold fist in particular),

The trust of his factionmates transferred to him and he crapped all over them.

We are aligned in the notion that the cool thing to do would have been to distribute the funds, and the uncool thing was keeping the funds.

It’s interesting to think about because of the bizarre game philosophy surrounding ownership of faction funds.

Technically you are retarded. Scamming is allowed in the game rules. So of course him scamming is legal. Great point! Bravo!

161 days old guy was there the longest???????????????????????

161 days old and he's already permanently tanked his account, and only for a mere 1.2B... What's with the recent sharp increase in these dipshits seemingly trying to speedrun ruining their accounts?

Man, Ben, your account is barely 5 months old, that's nothing in Torn. Just start over and don't be a piece of shit this time.

don't forget, Torn's primary source of new players is instagram slop ads so we're seeing an influx of instagram slop ad clicking players.